Friday, 21 November 2025

The Cardinal Bea Memorial Lecture 2011 - Heschel, Soloveitchik, Bayfield and the Point of Jewish - Christian Interfaith Dialogue

I was invited to give this lecture by the remarkable Sisters of Sion, way back in 2011. But with the 60th Anniversary of Nostra Aetate in the news, I'm realising I never posted it before so ... here you go.



 The Cardinal Bea Memorial Lecture 2011

 

Lord Harries, Baroness Richardson,

Friends,

Particularly the Sisters of Sion,

I am most grateful for the honour of this invitation to address you.

To know of some of your extraordinary work and the sense of openness and generosity of spirit that inspires your calling is humbling and inspirational.

Already, simply to be here, as a Rabbi, as a representative of a faith once treated as a fossil, at best, or cursed, at worst, is, in the context of the 2000+ year history of our respective faiths remarkable.

And that, unless I have desperately miscalculated, I feel under no threat of being lynched or attacked isn’t something that even now, even here, I take for granted.

I accept this invitation as an invitation to be honest, to share of my own struggles and those of my faith community – I’m not here to score points, interfaith dialogue is no longer a zero-sum game where a Jew’s success means a Christian’s failure or vice versa. We have come so far it’s almost beyond belief.

 

Indeed, it seems that much of this credit for this extra-ordinary shift in the relationships between Church, the Catholic Church in particular, and the Synagogue belongs to the man whose memory we honour tonight, Cardinal Bea.

I’m not particularly a scholar of the time, nor would consider myself an expert in Jewish-Catholic or Jewish-Christian dialogue (I will I hope justify my place here on a different basis), but I’ve been deeply touched by real warmth that seems to have existed between the Cardinal and my most important teacher, Rabbi Abraham Joshua Heschel.

Heschel was the leading Jewish theologian in discussions with the Vatican in the lead up to Vatican II and Edward Kaplan, Heschel’s biographer, records how Heschel spoke highly of Bea’s critical edition of Song of Songs – Bea, of course, being fluent in Hebrew and Aramaic among other languages.

Heschel could castigate, embarrass religious leaders. In a famous speech to the American Rabbinical Assembly Heschel castigated and embarrassed Rabbis who led services devoid of spirit and guts. And in a famous speech at a 1960s conference on Race and Religion he castigated and embarrassed faith leaders of all stripes for their failure to speak out against slavery in America. But he loved, admired and respected Cardinal Bea for he saw in the Cardinal both commitment to his own faith and also a commitment to recognise the faith of others.

 

Secondly, I’ve been aware of the place in which the Cardinal stood – in the eye of the storm around Vatican II.

The American Jewish Committee made representations to the Cardinal in the run up to Vatican II. They submitted a dossier, and I quote the dossier’s author, identifying and illustrating, ‘slanderous interpretations, oversimplifications, sweeping statements, unjust or inaccurate comparisons, invidious use of language, and significant omissions in American Catholic textbooks’ of the late 1950s and early 1960s. That can’t have been easy reading. It takes a capacious soul to make their way through material like that and respond with breadth of spirit and warmth.

 

And on another side, there were tremendous pressures from within the Church, for there were many in the Church who felt that accusations of deicide were entirely correct and a perpetuation of expiatory contempt for Jews was the only correct theological response to me and members of my faith.

 

The Cardinal also had to stand firm in the face of more than just a whiff of paranoiac anti-Jewish conspiracy theories.

 

The second session of Vatican II saw the wide distribution of a document called “The Jews and the Council in the Light of Holy Scripture and Tradition.” This pseudo-anonymous piece of antisemitism insisted that efforts to alter the Church’s traditional view of Jews were the result of a conspiracy in the council by Jews and Freemasons working on behalf of Communism. These paranoiac Catholic flames were flamed by Arab leaders and clerics, both Copt and Muslim, who pushed and pulled as their own interests dictated.

 

The notion that Cardinal Bea was able to stand as firm as he did in the face of such great challenge is already a tremendous achievement.

 

Nostra Aetate transformed the relationship of the Church and the Jewish people from one of enmity and fear into one of shared commitment; shared commitments to monotheism, the pursuit of peace, justice, to recognise that every human is created in the image of the divine and most important of all a commitment to oppose genocide and speak out against hatred dressed up in the sheepskin clothes of religious terminology.

 

And while the theologians and political bigwigs negotiate over commas and precise turns of phrase, I know all too personally how relationships between Jews and Catholics have been transformed by Nostra Aetate

 

I was born six years after Vatican II. My Jewish parents made the decision to send me to a Catholic School, St Anthony’s in Hampstead, where I received an incredible education inspired by the very best sentiments of open-hearted Catholic commitments to the value of enquiry and human compassion, shared with me, as a Jew; commitments given what we in Jewish circles would call a gashbanka – a seal of approval – by the language of Nostra Aetate. Indeed I know this is an evening in honour of one great servant of the Church, Cardinal Bea, but I hope the good Cardinal, looking down on us all today, would not object if I wish also to honour, in what I share today the memory of another Catholic hero, my headmaster of that time, Tim Patton.

 

I’m honoured and touched that Tim’s successor as headmaster of St Anthony’s School, Paul Keyte is able to be here today. I’m delighted the school continues to foster the very best open-hearted approach to the education of generations to come.

 

I mentioned earlier that I don’t deserve to be here as a historian, for I am not really a historian. I’m a practioner. I practice as a Jew, I practice inter-faith dialogue. I aspire to no level of expertise higher than that of being a practioner.

 

So I want share with you the questions at the heart of my contemporary practicing of interfaith encounter.

 

How much of one’s own faith does one have to give up on to fully acknowledge the faith of another?

Is it possible to believe that the other has erred without that being necessarily disrespectful?

Is it possible to be wholly committed to one’s own faith while still being a pluralist – can you have humility as well as belief?

And if I am not looking to give up on or even alter my own faith, as a result of interfaith dialogue, what is the point of interfaith dialogue?

 

Two end points in my own personal dialectic

Joseph Soloveitchik, known as The Rav, was the leader of American Orthodoxy in the 1960s. And he was not interested in Vatican II at all.

The Rav gave an important address to the massed ranks of American Orthodox Rabbis entitled ‘Confrontation,’ in which he turned his back on anything that could be considered pluralist – especially in relationship to the Church.

 

Jews and Christians should not seek, Soloveitchik demanded, ‘common denominators’ because to do so risks, he argued, frittering away the unique destiny of both faiths engaged in a singular normative gesture.’

Soloveitchik wouldn’t express any care for what the church may or may not say about Jews. He simply insisted that Jews reject any suggestion that our covenant has been superseded. He disdained any attempt to find mutually acceptable forms of language that iron out this central difference. He rejected apologetics, revisionism or other sweet words.

 

Soloveitchik also demanded mutual non–interference. Jews should not, he insisted, ask for adjustment to Christian rituals – no alteration in the liturgical readings during Holy week for example - and the same would apply to any supposed Christian discomfort with Jewish liturgy or ritual.

 

Our goal, said Soloveitchki, is to pursue our path – the path of Halakhah, the Hebrew Bible as understood by the Rabbis, and if the cost of having any other religion or national grouping saying anything nice about us is giving up on one iota of our commitment to that path, that cost is too great to pay.

 

Soloveitchik only spoke of his concern to put an end to attempts to find middle ground in matters theological, but his impact went beyond this. It’s hard to find Orthodox rabbis, certainly mainstream orthodox Rabbis willing to do very much with members of other faiths, certainly in public, certainly away from the photo-opportunities that seem to boost the ego of participants more than fix the problems of a broken world.

 

On my other side is the recently retired leader of British Reform Judaism, Tony Bayfield who wrote of the importance of transcending the stilted and lonely interactions between Jew and Christian which results in Christians praising for Jews for our family life and chicken soup but holding back on articulating the conviction 'it's a pity you are missing out on the greatest truth of all.' While Jews grudgingly praise Christians for their 'cathedrals and self-sacrificing love' while holding back on sharing a belief that Christianity is all based on a mistake. Bayfield believes that both Christians and Jews have to moderate our respective truth claims and give up on hubristic faith claims that claim our beliefs are right while others are wrong. Bayfield claims that we will only be able to enter into genuine and respectful dialogue if we can moderate our truth claims.

 

I consider both positions half-right, though I’m closer to Soloveitchik. Like Soloveitchik I have no problem with Christians thinking I have it all wrong. As long as they don't mind my thinking that they are mistaken. I’m not prepared to sacrifice the creeds of my own faith, the parts of my own self – to become more attractive in the eyes of a sister faith whose creeds, ultimately, are not my own.

 

We live in a society where we are tempted to embrace syncretism, but syncretism is not attractive to me.

Too often it results in a sort of cherry picking of  superficially attractive elements stripped of their deeper calls on our souls and integrity.

 

But I don't accept Soloveitchik's claim that interaction and engagement risks jeopardising our own unique path. My experience of serious Christian-Jewish dialogue has been one that has sharpened my own sense of my own faith, it's forced me to find language to justify my beliefs and practice when faced by an 'other' who understands God and the quest for holiness and decency in ways close to, but ultimately other than, my own.

 

Like Bayfield I accept that much Christian/Jewish dialogue is bland, politeness transcending honesty, but I don't accept respectful dialogue demands transcending my own faith claims. Nor, frankly, do I worry about a surfeit of politesse in Jewish Christian encounters - it's only been a blink of an eye since the stakes - when Jew and Christian encountered one another - were far more deadly than being gently bored. A few centuries of gentle boredom between Jews and Christians would be no bad thing.

 

Moreover, and it’s probably my most significant point of – I hope respectful  - difference with Rabbi Bayfield, I don't accept that my Jewish belief that Jesus is not, as a religious fact, a singular son of God, is necessarily to show a lack of respect to the Church. Similarly, I would not expect a Christian to show respect for my own faith by abnegating their sense in my cardinal religious error.

 

I don’t believe that respect is predicated on the need to accept the view of the other. Rather, the reverse; a relationship predicated on the primary need to agree with one another demands politesse triumphs over honesty and that is where I consider a lack of respect. It’s a relationship where the end points of agreement are going to be determined by the fall of a lot – whose turn is it to be right this week – yesterday we ate Italian, tonight let’s do Chinese, yesterday we did Jesus, tonight let’s do Torah

 

Or, alternatively, an overriding commitment to come to agreement simply reflects the relative hierarchical standings of the debaters – I’m stronger than you so you agree with me, or vice versa.

 

Respect means agreeing to suffer the other views of the other person even if they cause one discomfort. That is certainly a Jewish position.

Debate and disagreement, the process of sharpening alternate views is integral to the Jewish faith –

Makhloket – even have the phrase, Mahloket l’shem shamayim – disagreement  for the sake of heaven - is at the centre of the Rabbinic endeavour. We understand ourselves in dispute.

 

One Rabbinic tale to illustrate.

Set in the time of the Apostles

When Reish Lakish, one half of the greatest Rabbinic double act of its time passes away, he leaves Rabbi Yohanan bereft. The Rabbis bring another Rabbi to the table who agrees with everything Rabbi Yohanan says, but this only increases the survivor's sense of despair at the death of his partner.

 

Clarity, refinement, honesty and integrity are forged in the pit of rigorous, principled, engagement.

Not dependent on agreement.

 

Judaism loves difference. The first Rabbinic text, traditionally taught to young children features two people arguing over who should own a found piece of cloth. ‘I found it and it’s all mine,’ they both claim. Talmudic study is principally the attempt to find ways for contradictory opinions to stand even in their opposition. For three years, the Talmud records, the Houses of two of the great Rabbis of the Ancient period, Hillel and Shammai disputed, eventually a Divine Voice is heard to proclaim ‘[both opinions] are the words of the living God.’ Perhaps tellingly, the substance of the disagreement is long forgotten. The point, surely, is that God’s perspective is so qualitatively beyond that of humans that points of difference visible from a human perspective melt away when viewed from the level of the cosmos itself. To claim that my finite human perspective is capable of understanding all the truth there is an act of appalling hubris.

 

In 2000 over 220 Jewish scholars published ‘Dabru Emet’ a  document on the relationship between Judaism and Christianity. It noted, ‘The humanly irreconcilable differences between Jews and Christians will not be settled until God redeems the entire world as promised in Scripture.’ Indeed.

 

A last Rabbinic text. In the Mishnah, the foundational document of Rabbinic Judaism, at least 1800 years old, the Rabbis ask why God created all humanity from a single ‘Adam’ – a single first human. My favourite answer is that this was done to increase our wonderment at the glory of God. When a King of flesh and blood mints a coin, the Rabbi offer as a parable, every coin comes out looking the same, but when the King of Kings, the Holy Blessed One, made an original mint –Adam – every human comes out differently. This text justifies the appreciation of otherness in humanity; be that people with other skin colours, nationalities and even religions. We come closer to understanding the glory of God as we appreciate the differences between us and that demands our engagement with interfaith.

 

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